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octopus prime

The right to remain silent

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https://www.yahoo.com/news/woman-arrested-staying-silent-during-traffic-stop-sues-143925452.html Woman arrested for staying silent during traffic stop sues

TRENTON, N.J. (AP) — A Philadelphia woman who was arrested after she refused to answer questions during a traffic stop in New Jersey has sued state police, claiming troopers violated basic rules by arresting her for remaining silent.

Rebecca Musarra, an attorney, filed the federal civil rights lawsuit after the Oct. 16 stop on Route 519 near the border with Pennsylvania in Warren County, NJ.com reported (http://bit.ly/21zKGbV ). At least three troopers insisted after she was pulled over that refusing to answer questions was a criminal act, according to the lawsuit.

Spokesmen for the state police and the attorney general's office, which is representing the troopers, declined to comment on the allegations. State police spokesman Capt. Stephen Jones said the department's internal affairs office conducts a review any time misconduct is alleged.

"In the event that problems are identified, training and/or disciplinary measures are implemented where appropriate," Jones said in an email.

Lawyers for the state have sought in court filings to have the case dismissed, claiming that the troopers "acted in good faith and without fraud or malice."

A trooper pulled Musarra over for suspected speeding, requested her license, registration and insurance, and asked if she knew why she was being pulled over, according to dash camera footage obtained by NJ.com through an open records request. Musarra said she provided the documents but didn't respond to the troopers.

"You're going to be placed under arrest if you don't answer my questions," one of the troopers told her before she was handcuffed and taken to a police station. Musarra asked the troopers if she was being detained, and one of the troopers said, "Yeah, obstruction."

Musarra said a supervisor watched dashboard camera footage and let her go without charges.

 

I  also refuse to talk to police in a traffic stop other than to tell them to give me a ticket or let me be on my way.  Never been arrested for it. 

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They arrested her for remaining silent and then read her the Miranda Rights which begins with "You have the right to remain silent".

:picard-facepalm:

 

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The epitome of stupid, those cops. Did they not even question what they were doing? They always ask me: Do you know why you were pulled over?  I always say, "no idea" why did you do that? lol

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You are under obligation to follow the lawful order of law enforcement. (give me your name, etc.)

Your Miranda rights don't kick in until you are arrested for a crime. (failure to give name, etc.)

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4 minutes ago, VonLud said:

You are under obligation to follow the lawful order of law enforcement. (give me your name, etc.)

Your Miranda rights don't kick in until you are arrested for a crime. (failure to give name, etc.)

Not really.  

The U.S. Supreme Court recently ruled that you are required to clearly and explicitly state that you “invoke your right to remain silent”, your “5th Amendment guarantee against self-incrimination, or words to that effect.

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Posted (edited)

3 minutes ago, Walk Softly said:

Not really.  

The U.S. Supreme Court recently ruled that you are required to clearly and explicitly state that you “invoke your right to remain silent”, your “5th Amendment guarantee against self-incrimination, or words to that effect.

True.

I was talking about simple shit like give your name.

You can't just sit silent or you will get arrested.

Edit: Or "detained"

Edited by VonLud

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Posted (edited)

@VonLud

You gotta be clear or else you are part of the problem.

I want clear and debatable discourse, not bullshit one line, "gotcha's".

I'm on fire tonight, Von.  

Learn someone's motivation and you can do a lot... eh?

How bout those beers?  Am I flying to Arizona or are you coming to TX?

Edited by Walk Softly

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When they ask you if you know why you were pulled over, they are trying to get you to admit to wrong doing which is self incrimination.  It's not just making idle conversation. Now, if I say I know why, I am incriminating myself. They really shouldn't have the right to ask anyone that question but they do it every stinking time.  The onus is on them. You don't have to roll your windows down for them either, just crack it enough to "show me your papers please".  Slide them through.  If they tell you to get out of the car, they better have a reason for that, too. And never, ever let them search your car.  They'll get pissed off and threaten you that they'll make problems for you. Just tell them, you are exercising your 4th amendment right and they need to go get the proper paperwork. Everyone  just goes along to get along with the bully cops. I'm not doing it anymore. If they wanna search my stuff, they are going to have to get a warrant. Period. 

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7 minutes ago, Walk Softly said:

@VonLud

You gotta be clear or else you are part of the problem.

I want clear and debatable discourse, not bullshit one line, "gotcha's".

I'm on fire tonight, Von.  

Learn someone's motivation and you can do a lot... eh?

How bout those beers?  Am I flying to Arizona or are you coming to TX?

I was born in Texas. (true)

Arizona is gay. (true)

New Mexico is where the milk and honey flows free.

As long as you know the score.

 

For Cinnamon: You are right. Never give them shit.

It goes right at the top of the report.

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5 minutes ago, VonLud said:

I was born in Texas. (true)

Arizona is gay. (true)

New Mexico is where the milk and honey flows free.

As long as you know the score.

I guess that means the first few are on me...

New Mexico it is.  I've been to a few cool casinos there.  And an observatory before I switched to the flat side.

As for the thread

Don't give em shit when they question you!  And yes, their first question, do you know why I pulled you over is designed to get you to verbally admit that you did "x."  

I'm a professional,  but I have gotten out of a ticket (I can't verify this is exactly the reason) because I was driving 5 over  (cruise control) and a trooper going the other way in a 70mph zone turned around and had to be going 110 to approach me as quickly as he did... he asked me the usual question and I said, I'm not sure, but I'm glad you stopped because I visually clocked you at about 100mph.  How do you justify breaking the speed limit by over 30mph for a non emergency?  

He literally just laughed and told me to slow down and have a good night.  

Either way... I didn't get a ticket that night. 

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3 minutes ago, Walk Softly said:

I guess that means the first few are on me...

New Mexico it is.  I've been to a few cool casinos there.  And an observatory before I switched to the flat side.

As for the thread

Don't give em shit when they question you!  And yes, their first question, do you know why I pulled you over is designed to get you to verbally admit that you did "x."  

I'm a professional,  but I have gotten out of a ticket (I can't verify this is exactly the reason) because I was driving 5 over  (cruise control) and a trooper going the other way in a 70mph zone turned around and had to be going 110 to approach me as quickly as he did... he asked me the usual question and I said, I'm not sure, but I'm glad you stopped because I visually clocked you at about 100mph.  How do you justify breaking the speed limit by over 30mph for a non emergency?  

He literally just laughed and told me to slow down and have a good night.  

Either way... I didn't get a ticket that night. 

Once, I had the fastest car in the land.

I hit 130 as I shifted into fifth gear while passing three State Police cruisers running radar on I-25.

None batted an eye.

Go big or go home.

I think that's how the government f***s us. (the big lie)

 

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The "Pony-tail" has another perspective!

 

 

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